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Canada to focus efforts on Kandahar city

From Wednesday's Globe and Mail

After a failed effort to establish outposts in Taliban territory, new policy concentrates on areas where Afghan government is strong ...Read the full article

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  1. Richard Roskell from Canada writes: I'm tellin' ya, you couldn't make this stuff up.

    "Some military observers liken the new approach to an 'adopt-a-village program, or, more wryly, the creation of miniature 'Walt-Disneystans,' - essentially places where life is made to seem a lot sunnier than elsewhere."

    Disneystan? Gee-zus! I've said it before and I'll say it again: EVERY war that goes on too long inevitably descends into farce. Over a hundred young Canadians dead for this.

    "Canadian officials are planning to direct aid to the most receptive neighbourhoods in and around Kandahar city, leaving out places deemed too far-flung or 'empathetic' to the Taliban insurgency."

    Too "far-flung?" For god's sake, the places they've pulled out of are a stone's throw away. It's like Mississauga is to Toronto, or Dorval to Old Montreal.

    "Col. Turenne... spoke of steering the best-trained, least-corrupt police toward the better neighbourhoods in Kandahar so they can do actual investigative work."

    Pity the poorer neighbourhoods, huh? The 'more-corrupt' police will be working there, presumably. NOT that a situation like that would encourage the Taliban, or anything.

    Look, if Canadian soldiers are withdrawing to Fortress Kandahar, that's great by me. Hopefully they will no longer be getting blown up by IED's, nor will they be calling in air strikes on villages. But can we please dispense with the ridiculous sham that goes with it? Are we not past the window-dressing stage in this war? It's an embarrassment.
  2. Dik Coates from Canada writes: Best to get them out of harms way when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians...
  3. Sl Cha from Canada writes: Canada had sacrificed 118 troops for someone else's war...
    Should canadians die for Hilary's bombing that killed 95 children in one shot...?
  4. Thomas Price from Whitefish, Canada writes: So what has our troops been doing up to now? The NATO forces seem to be bound to specific geographic areas without expanding and in fact retreating and with no hope so far of joining hands into a concerted effort. Is this because of a superior enemy, ineptitude or by design. The headline makes a farce of the effort to date.
  5. Dik Coates from Canada writes: Thomas Price... the farce is the headline...
  6. N Dawg from Canada writes: Dik Coates from Canada writes: Best to get them out of harms way when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians...
    Posted 19/05/09 at 11:41 PM EDT | An editor has been alerted to this comment | Link to Comment

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    This comment is offensive.
  7. Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes:

    Dik Coates from Canada:

    "...when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians..."

    "Start" slaughtering? Where have you been the last 7 years?
  8. Billiam Smith from Montreal, Canada writes: "Some military observers..."

    Biased reporting alert! Who are "some military observers"? Surely it wouldn't be difficult to cite them by name. Is it just you, Colin Freeze?
  9. Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes: This war is getting so old that they are running out of propaganda, recycling hilariously optimistic puff pieces. Recall Graeme Smith's filing from Februay, 2007, featuring a 5-year plan for Khandahar produced by city planners:

    "...a 35-page document that calls for a "prosperous, beautiful, well-developed Kandahar city," a place transformed from a jumble of mud-brick warrens into a modern centre with paved walking paths, electric buses and public Internet kiosks.
    The sheer optimism of the vision -- recycling plants, sports facilities and tree nurseries -- seems almost naive, but the official in charge of planning says it's feasible.

    "We have a dream," said Mohammed Rahim Rahimi, head of Kandahar's economy department. "Afghanistan will be the best country in Asia."
  10. Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes: Given the only really viable economic actvity in Afghanistan these days, that dream must have been opium-induced.

    Smith then went to ex-CIA President of Kabul Karzei's two brothers for the real deal:

    "I'm very, very hopeful, and maybe that will surprise your readers in Canada," said Qayum Karzai, the elder brother of the Afghan President and an influential politician in Kandahar. "We have absolutely no reason to give up."

    ...but for being summarily executed by the Taliban.

    Smith then regaled us with the glorious March of the Green Thumbtacks:

    A flood of aid projects started arriving in the districts, and many villages are now secure enough for foreigners to visit.
    A map at the Kandahar offices of UN-Habitat illustrates the creeping progress, as the staff mark villages with green thumbtacks to indicate they've joined a program to organize local-development councils.

    With money from Canada, the UN-Habitat staff hope to expand into two more districts this year.

    Whether those green thumbtacks continue to march outward from Kandahar city, whether the influence of the Afghan government continues to strengthen in the outlying districts, will depend partly on the intensity and location of this year's fighting.

    Leaving aside the two Karzei brothers for a better and unbiased evaluation of the situation, Smith allows us into the mind of Gavin Buchan, political director of Canada's reconstruction team:

    "Those dreams of paved sidewalks and wind-generated electricity may require more patience than the Afghans realize, said Mr. Buchan of the provincial reconstruction team. But the fundamentals of an agricultural economy are strong in this province, he added, and the rest can be built on that base.

    "Bike paths and windmills may take a little time," he said. "But at the same time, it can be done."
  11. Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes:
    Poor Graeme Smith, who then churned out pro-NATO apocrypha upon a daily basis certainly straining not only one's imagination but especially one's patience.

    An oppressive air of unreality must have permeated that government office of yet another obverse Don Quixote who prattles on about windmills, whilst but a few short kilometers away, a senior Taliban commander spoke of fielding a force of 10,000 this spring and a pro-Taliban rally in the capital city then saw 30,000 locals attend.

    Windmills? Bicycle paths? Electric buses no less. Bureaucrats playing with green tacks while 1,000 children die?

    This betrayed, as it still does today, not optimism, but profound depression, as the hopeless resile into paradisiacal fantasies and sick dreams of power and glory.

    Only in a war zone is the coming of spring a time for dread. Night's blanket is pulled off ever earlier in the shivering morn, and eyes wide shut are pried open by the sun's first fingernails. How many soldiers, politicians, mercenaries, mothers, must espy their bedroom ceilings and curse the turning of the world. Staring up at the stain, the chip, the crack with a sinking soul rising to another day, fear's butterfly briefly alights: run! The soft drips of thawing snow shed glinting trickles shot red with the dawn, and delicate green shoots from underground push up with the force of missile tips auguring the coming bloom of black flowers for the bereaved. If Iraq collapses into utter defeat for the Americans when the Kurds and Arabs go to civil war, defeat in Afghanistan will be politically impossible to accept. How soon will we hear the echo:

    "Surrender is forbidden. [Forces] will hold their positions to the last man and the last round and by their heroic endurance will make an unforgettable contribution towards the establishment of a defensive line and the salvation of the Western World."
    January 1943
    Hitler's orders to the 6th Army in Stalingrad.
  12. F.T. Ward from Canada writes: I was under the impression that the vast majority of Afghans were anti-Taliban and pro-Canadian Army because of all the good deeds the CF does, how our troops are so much more professional than the Americans and how rotten the Taliban are.

    This would appear to have been an optimistic estimate of the situation if not simply propaganda. Canada has, despite spending over $11 billion in incremental costs, with at least another $19 billion coming, three years on cannot maintain a handful of rural police posts and even attempt to secure all the districts of the provincial capital.

    Combine this with the recent story of how the CF needs to use contractors to teach junior officers of the Afghan Army and you should start to ask what we pay the CF for.

    I'll grant that most of the troops and junior leaders are fine but it's time to start asking questions about the quality of the people at the top. From day one the military has spun this mission to its own advantage and now the chickens are coming home to roost as the withdrawal forced by the inability to control it's area of operations and declining morale start.
  13. UCant Haveitall from Canada writes: So the troops are trying a new approach to development, rebuilding, aid, alternatives to poppies, connecting with ordinary Afghans........and you guys are 100% critical. Back into your armchairs, dear generals!
  14. Ted Arnold from Canada writes:
    END THE OCCUPATION!
    ALL FOREIGN TROOPS OUT NOW!
  15. Another vicious kick right in the face from Orwell's Ghost, writes: Several weeks ago, Steve Harper appeared on US TV and declared the Afghan mission futile.

    Following that declaration, did he do the responsible thing and withdraw our troops from harm's way?

    No. Stephen Harper left our troops to die in a cause he says is lost.

    This is disgusting.

    Every Canadian's life lost now in Afghanistan is blood on Harper's hands.

    Support the troops -- bring them home.

    .
  16. Another vicious kick right in the face from Orwell's Ghost, writes: N Dawg from Canada writes: Dik Coates from Canada writes: Best to get them out of harms way when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians...
    Posted 19/05/09 at 11:41 PM EDT | An editor has been alerted to this comment | Link to Comment

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    This comment is offensive.

    ========================

    How so?
  17. david tarbuck from Ukraine writes: From the rediculous to the absurd! "Concentrate where the Afghan government is strong??" If they need foreign troops in Khanandar where they are "strong" what hope is there for a future united country? And when will Canada be finished trying to fill a bottomless hole? With dead and wounded Canadians?
  18. Catherine Medernach from Winnipeg, Canada writes: Canadian troops withdrew from some outposts because they were having the opposite effect from what was intended. Instead of discouraging the Taliban - they became targets. In watching them the Taliban could see that they were succeeding and determined that they needed to disrupt the CF/PRT efforts by increasing attacks. This has been the case since the CF first moved into Kandahar. They also had to take the time to prepare for the deployments of the Dutch and the British which meant clearing out as many Taliban as possible.

    Also, given that there appear to be quite a few Taliban in the province, as there are in the neighboring provinces where the British and Dutch are stationed, it is to be expected that there will be increased conflict this summer with the US troops moving in. Such conflict is not conducive to reconstruction efforts. That does not mean they will not continue to do as much as possible in the meantime.
  19. Sl Cha from Canada writes: And just few days ago LTTE Tamils of Scarborough wanted to send Canadian troops to save their Prabakaran...
  20. Merely an Observer from Canada writes: Another vicious kick right in the face from Orwell's Ghost, writes: "Several weeks ago, Steve Harper appeared on US TV and declared the Afghan mission futile."
    Um, no he didn't.
    Nice try making crap up to fit your biased point of view though.
  21. F.T. Ward from Canada writes: Catherine: Wouldn't the answer to stroppy Taliban in the districts have been to kill or arrest them? I've never heard of running away as a successful counter-guerrilla strategy. If I remember my history the normal way to deal with guerrillas in rural areas is ambushes. Tearing down forts because they upset the local villains hasn't been a usual response by professional armies. Perhaps if we withdraw all the CF troops all the way to Valcartier we can reduce the violence in Kandahar even more as it seems we're the trouble and not the solution.
  22. Catherine Medernach from Winnipeg, Canada writes: F.T. Ward - the CF is not 'running away'. The problem was that they were serving as a magnet to the Taliban who were attacking civilians. CF patrols seek out the Taliban but the Taliban prefer IEDs and suicide bombers which often kill civilians. Rarely do they directly attack the CF because they generally lose in direct confrontations - even when they use ambushes.

    BTW Because the local Afghans were complaining about the Taliban coming in at night - when the troops were not around - CF troops also went into some areas under cover of darkness and surprised the Taliban with their presence come daylight. They adjust their tactics as needed given specific circumstances.

    Also, they are probably anticipating what is going to happen during the new fighting season and with many new US troops on the ground. Outposts simply tie them down rather than allowing them to move as needed. And it makes no sense to leave the structures for the Taliban to utilize.
  23. Sl Cha from Canada writes: But why should Canadian troops have to die for a US cause...?
  24. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    By the way, Catherine, are your comments 'on-topic'? LOL
  25. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    By the way, Catherine, are your comments 'on-topic'? LOL
  26. Comments closed, censored, hidden, deleted, disappeared from Peso-onie land, Canada writes: "After a failed effort to establish outposts in Taliban territory, new policy concentrates on areas where Afghan government is strong..." --- Eh! I thought we were winning! I am sure I had read we were winning!! -- Am I now reading that we failed and were, in fact, defeated? Am I reading we have therefore decided to withdraw and, from now on, to remain "within the wire"? --- If so, that deserves a much wider coverage than this! It should make the Globe's headline, and with a better than usual type of analysis. --- Impossible? Can't do it, you say?
  27. Comments closed, censored, hidden, deleted, disappeared from Peso-onie land, Canada writes: Richard Roskell from Canada writes: "I've said it before and I'll say it again: EVERY war that goes on too long inevitably descends into farce." --- Richard has obviously graduated from one of the oldest, world-renowned institution, the Sun Tzu War College. Witness: "When you engage in actual fighting, if victory is long in coming, then men's weapons will grow dull and their ardor will be damped. ... Again, if the campaign is protracted, the resources of the State will not be equal to the strain. ... Thus, though we have heard of stupid haste in war, cleverness has never been seen associated with long delays. ... There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare." (Sun Tzu)
  28. F.T. Ward from Canada writes: Catherine: I thought the choices in the security part of COIN were to either protect the civilians from the Taliban and/or find the Taliban and kill them. It seems the CF has developed a third way. Do neither and move to where it's safer. This sounds hard but if the forts were a magnet for Taliban then the CF must not want to make contact and at same time couldn't give a hoot about protecting the locals.

    Do you think the generals have been told to limit CF casualties (especially ones from PQ) no matter what? That may explain abandoning the bases and avoiding contact. It certainly makes no military sense so perhaps there's a domestic political angle at play.
  29. Sl Cha from Canada writes: And you got Gardiner highway blocked...

    Maybe Afghan Canadians start blocking highways to get Canadian troops back...

    They don't want their children bombed...

    Or we wouldn't allow Afghans to block any highway...? For they are Muslims...?
  30. Jeff Wong from North York, Canada writes: KABUL – The U.S. military said today that at least 20 civilians and 60 insurgents died in a U.S.-Taliban clash earlier this month, contradicting the Afghan government's assertion that 140 civilians were killed.

    Another air strike by NATO-led forces killed eight Afghan civilians following a battle with militants in southern Helmand province on Tuesday, where Afghan troops also killed 25 militants, officials said.

    ---------------------

    http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/636782
  31. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Neo Cynic, GREAT catch! One of the ways you can tell that a war has gone on far too long is when they just recycle the same ol' propaganda.

    Disneystan and the March of the Green Thumbtacks. Why, I can almost hear the 'Optimistic Voices' now:

    "You're out of the woods, you're out of the dark, step into the light..."
  32. Catherine Medernach from Winnipeg, Canada writes: F.T. Ward - your posts are starting to read a lot like Roskell's with everything twisted to criticize the CF.

    As a matter of fact, it was the ANA that decided to leave the outpost- they dismantled it so that the Taliban could not use it. It was not guarded by the CF but by about 60 Afghan troops with a small team of CF mentors. Many Afghans guarding the outpost were dying due to attacks by the Taliban. It was not safely accessible by land and had to be resupplied by helicopter drops. It was also decided that the ANA troops would be of greater value in more densely populated areas closer to Kandahar City. Neither the ANA nor the CF considered the outpost as strategically necessary given that the more established CF FOB Masum Ghar remains in place. So they left to work in areas with more people - troops in stationary posts tend to be of limited value in terms of protecting anyone.
  33. rick jackson from Cordoba, Argentina, writes: I think it is just about time to bring the troops home, it is like in Conrads "the heart of Darkness" the civilized try to change the locals, what happens is the other way around. We had a good reason to go to Afganistan but the country in unchangable Alex the Great had no luck the British Empire couldn't do it and we are going to do it? Afganistan has been a hell hole for 2 thousand years, and like the Congo no amount of money and men is going to change that. We can fullfil our promises to 2011 but after that good bye good luck. We are better off giving the Taliban their own country, a part of Afganistan and when they misbehave bomb them, right now they have nothing so nothing to lose. I do not think Canada has an obligation to Afganistan, we didn't break it was already broken. I prefer spending money on our native reserves this cost about 7 billion dollars a year, but atleast the money stays in the country and there is some small progress. We are going to spend 30 billion in Afganistan and will have nothing to show for it. Unfortuately this is not like the rebuilding of Japan or Germany after WWII to rebuild a society that has never been built in the first place is a misnormer. The rules of our society do not apply. Investment here is wasted.
  34. Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes:

    Richard Roskell:

    With the advent of Microsoft Word and the search and replace tool, the Pentagon can help cut the deficit by just dusting off old Vietnam reports, communiques, plans, reports, estimates, projections, and inserting "Afghanistan" for "Vietnam". Let me count the nanoseconds until we hear of the Afghanization of the War, and of course, Peace With Honour.
  35. Mark S Noel from Canada writes: I'm confused didn't you crazy left wing fanatics know that your hero Obama approves of sending troops to Afganistan? What happened to singing his praises?
  36. Comments closed, censored, hidden, deleted, disappeared from Peso-onie land, Canada writes: Mark S Noel from Canada writes: I'm confused didn't you crazy left wing fanatics know that your hero Obama approves of sending troops to Afganistan? What happened to singing his praises? --- MSN, it's always so amusing to see those who are not "crazy left wing fanatics" rely on an Obama to pursue their own agenda, too coward as they are to ever take responsibility (even after years in power) for the appalling situation the US and the world are in, at present!!!..... -- What you seem to forget, MSN, is that contrary to people like you, "crazy left wing fanatics" do not ever support anybody unconditionally. As crazy as they are, they still have enough lucidity left to challenge their preferred leaders. --- I understand that you be confused over this: principled conduct is totally alien to the so-called "wise right wing moderates" who got us in that mess in the first place.
  37. Comments closed, censored, hidden, deleted, disappeared from Peso-onie land, Canada writes: Neo Cynic from Bahamas writes:"Let me count the nanoseconds until we hear of the Afghanization of the War, and of course, Peace With Honour." --- NC, just a reminder: the vietnamization of the war never led to Peace with Honour; it rather led to defeat in disgrace.... with, in the short term, 5 million Vietnamese dead left behind and too many Vietnamese maimed, injured, etc. to even begin to count them. --- "We (the losers) never were in the accounting business", were we?
  38. Geoffrey May from Canada writes: I guess we won't need those tanks and helicopters anymore.Are they still under warrantee ?
    So now we're back to square one.
    Should reduce our casualty rate , and as an armchair general, I assure you that's a good thing
  39. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: A week ago Sir Richard believed all CF and NATO news briefs were just propaganda put out with the intent of diverting attention away from other less favourable news stories coming out of Afghanistan.

    Don't tell me that now he actually believes everything that is being reported.

    Regardless of what Richard the vintner (or is it whiner? Regardless, he obviously consumes more than he sells) and his buddy Neo Cynic (the resident undercover American) think and say, Canada's course is set in combat roles until 2011. Too bad every thing they say here is nothing more than a waste of bandwidth.
  40. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.

    - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
  41. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: To lie is human. Not getting caught is divine.
    -- Robert Anton Wilson
    ----------------------------
    Its too bad you get caught too often. But hey, you are human.
  42. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Dress it as we may...huzza it, and sing swaggering songs about it, what is war, nine times out of ten, but murder in uniform?

    - Douglas Jerrold
  43. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Preventive war was an invention of Hitler. Frankly, I would not even listen to anyone seriously that came and talked about such a thing.

    - Dwight D. Eisenhower
  44. Dik Coates from Canada writes:
    N Dawg from Canada writes: Dik Coates from Canada writes: Best to get them out of harms way when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians...

    Posted 19/05/09 at 11:41 PM EDT | An editor has been alerted to this comment | Link to Comment

    ***

    This comment is offensive.

    I don't think it is... in fact, I think I should have added "slaughtering them in greater numbers".

    See Neocynic's comment...

    "...when the Americans start slaughtering the civilians..."

    "Start" slaughtering? Where have you been the last 7 years?

    You are correct; are you happy if I correct it as noted above?

    Dik
  45. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature, and has no chance of being free unless made or kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
    -John Stuart Mill
  46. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently.

    ~Friedrich Nietzsche
  47. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes: Our country is now geared to an arms economy bred in an artificially induced psychosis of war hysteria and an incessant propaganda of fear.

    - General Douglas MacArthur
  48. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    War: A wretched debasement of all the pretenses of civilization.

    - General Omar N. Bradley
  49. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    My mental faculties remained in suspended animation while I obeyed the orders of the higher-ups. This is typical with everyone in the military.

    - General Smedley Butler (USMC)
  50. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    It is painful enough to discover with what unconcern they speak of war and threaten it. I have seen enough of it to make me look upon it as the sum of all evils.

    - General Stonewall Jackson
  51. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Any forces that would impose their will on other nations will certainly face defeat.

    - General Vo Nguyen Giap
  52. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: Nice quote from MacArthur, Richard.

    Interesting how a successful General speaks of the war attitude of a nation.

    Does that not go against your opinion that generals and soldier want to go to war so that they can kill and earn glory in the blood of others?

    Here is another quote by MacArthur:
    "I know war as few other men now living know it, and nothing to me is more revolting. I have long advocated its complete abolition, as its very destructiveness on both friend and foe has rendered it useless as a method of settling international disputes."

    How is this duplicity possible?

    Or is it because it is only those that have seen war, are the only ones who truly know its horror...

    while you safely complain from behind your computer in the peaceful Okanagan Valley.
  53. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    My first wish is to see this plague of mankind, war, banished from the earth.

    - General George Washington
  54. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    It is useless to attack men who could not be controlled even if conquered, while failure would leave us in an even worse position.

    - Athenian General Nikias (5th century B.C.)
  55. Dik Coates from Canada writes:
    as memory serves...

    "It's always the old who lead us to the war,
    It's always the young who fall.
    Now look at all we've won with a sabre and a gun,
    Can you tell me if it's worth it all"

    with apologies to Phil Ochs.
  56. Merely an Observer from Canada writes: "some Afghans don't view having sex with children as a crime at all.
    ....stop meddling in their lives."

    -Richard Roskell from Naramata
  57. Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act.

    - George Orwell
  58. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: "Canadians have never been wimps at going to war. We're always among the first in when the cause is true."

    -Richard Roskell
    Posted 21/02/07 at 4:52 PM EDT
  59. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: "The reality is, that Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan will coolly and with full intent take the lives of innocent Afghans. They don't do it because they're psychopaths; they do it because that's what soldiers sometimes do. There's no sense whatsoever in trying to hide the truth;"

    -Richard Roskell
    Posted 25/12/07 at 4:42 AM EDT
  60. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: "Okay, okay... I lied. Sometimes I do it because it's entertaining as well."

    -Richard Roskell
    Posted 01/02/09
  61. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: Richard Roskell from Naramata, Canada writes:

    Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.

    - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
  62. Richard Roskell from Canada writes:

    Oh, you like quotes out of context, and quotes using part of a comment, Earl?

    "Generals and soldiers want to go to war so that they can kill and earn glory in the blood of others." - Earl Street (Quoted from above at 20/05/09, 11:02 PM.

    How's that again, Earl? LOL
  63. Earl Street from Petawawa, Canada writes: Richard,

    My words to you were: "generals and soldier want to go to war so that they can kill and earn glory in the blood of others?"

    I see my sentence was a question ending with a "?". You put in a period ".".

    That would be lying, Richard, something I know you find entertaining.

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