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Do I need to quaff protein powders to gain muscle?

From Friday's Globe and Mail

Go easy on the protein shakes, big guy ...Read the full article

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  1. Stephen Dedalus from Canada writes: Does Booster Juice count? Do you have to lift weights as well? As Thoreau said, 'Beware of enterprises that require physical or mental effort.' 'Course I'm not sure if it was 'the' Thoreau.
  2. L Harder from Canada writes: The obsession with muscle mass is absurd unless you are in Sumo or playing football. It impairs athletic function if overdone.

    There are some legitimate reasons for weight work. In particular women can benefit to maintain bone density especially once they are out of their 20's.

    The muscle bound guys should probably get involved in a real sport.
  3. Mikey Gault from The Moral Highground, Canada writes: L Harder from Canada writes: The obsession with muscle mass is absurd unless you are in Sumo or playing football. It impairs athletic function if overdone.

    There are some legitimate reasons for weight work. In particular women can benefit to maintain bone density especially once they are out of their 20's.

    The muscle bound guys should probably get involved in a real sport.

    ***

    Why do you have such irrational issues with people who lift weights? There are significant benefits to athletes in all sports in lifting weights. Not everyone becomes a 280 pound musclehead. Maybe you and your girlfriends should just stick to yoga and shuffleboard.

    As for the article itself, why only cite one study from Mac? Its not exactly the definitive study. FACT: if you want to gain muscle, you need to eat about 5 times a day. One or two of those meals can be a protein shake. Don't listen to some egghead at a second-rate university. Talk to real athletes and bodybuilders. They stress protein and carbs!
  4. edward prior from Montreal, Canada writes: Mikey Gault: While there may never be THE definitive study, it would be absurd to ignore the findings of reputable researchers whose profession it is to understanding the bio-chemical workings of the body. Of course, it is always of interest to ask questions of athletes and body-builders who appear to have been successful in their efforts. Unfortunately, none of their answers will, in any way, address underlying fundamentals of genetic pre-disposition to physical development, and, equally unfortunately, one will have to assume that any answers they give will be the truth. They can tell me all they want about what THEY eat and how much, but that tells me nothing about what and how much I should eat; nor does it tell me if or what performance enhancing drugs they might be using. In short: the eggheads give me facts; the athletes give me anecdotes.
  5. Justin Egli from Canada writes: 'Timing also matters: You'll build muscle more effectively if you take in protein within about an hour of finishing your workout. The optimal post-workout dose is about 20 grams, according to a McMaster study in the January issue of the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition. That's equivalent to about 600 millilitres of skim milk, four medium eggs or 80 grams of cooked beef. Powders, shakes and bars offer a convenient way to get this right after a workout - but then again, so does a tuna sandwich.'

    There's a little bit more science that you guys neglected. The last thing any weight lifter wants is a slow absorbing protein post-workout. They need something that goes to work on repair right away. That's the reason why those guys are carrying massive barrels of protein powder in their bag. After a crazy weight workout, you need a fast absorbing protein that goes to work on your muscles right away... enter whey protein.
  6. CrossFit Guelph from Guelph, Canada writes: If your sport is Body Building you do. If your sport is functional fitness, defined as the ability to perform well at all manner of physical tasks, then NO. Eat your lean meats, veggies, nuts, seeds, fruit and stay off the high glycemic index foods and you will be amazed at the results you can get. Milk, with a handful of nuts is a great post workout meal. Check out...
    http://robbwolf.com/ if you want to really tune your diet.
  7. Kevin Desmoulin from TO, Canada writes: It just take time to built muscle no happen what. Eat before you work out, Water through out. Those raw eggs in a glass work.
  8. Chris Kempan from Winnipeg, Canada writes: The Protein book by Lyle McDonald talks about this issue at length. He summarizes and complies the results of 100s of studies and gives recommendations. I like to get at least 1g/lb, or 2.2g/Kg bodyweight. Of course per kg lean muscle mass is a better measure. The protein requirements for a 200 lb athlete @ 7% bf is a lot different than a 200 lb couch potato @ 25%.

    And as mentioned, tuna or beef following a workout is not fast enough to provide aminos for protein synthesis. In well trained people, protein synthesis is only elevated for a short period of time. Sipping a whey protein and carb drink as soon as weight training begins and until it is over is the way to go.
  9. L F from Canada writes: What can you use if you are allergic to nuts?
  10. Eric Helmer from Canada writes: Over the many years of hard lifting and the mountains of protein consumed, I often wondered what if any damage was I doing to my kidneys. I was comfortable knowing my cro-magnon ancestors would sit down to a 10 kilo helping of juicey raw meat without worrying too much about kidney stones. Now I know for sure.
  11. Another vicious kick right in the face from Orwell's Ghost, writes: Do I need to quaff protein powders to gain muscle?

    Well, there's always the option of eating food instead.
  12. Montgomery C. Burns from Springfield, Canada writes: Sipping a protein shake after a workout is the whey to go!
  13. Nat Pop from Canada writes: Another vicious kick right in the face from Orwell's Ghost, writes: 'Do I need to quaff protein powders to gain muscle?'
    Well, there's always the option of eating food instead.
    --------------------------------------------------------

    For a serious weight lifter, it's not, because to get the high amount of proteins required to recover from the workout and build muscle mass you'd have to eat huge quantities of food, which would mean you'd also take in huge amounts of carbohydrates and fat. Unless your goal is to build muscle mass AND get fat, eating food instead of drinking a protein shake is not an option.

    A regular person who is just going to the gym to keep fit though can ignore the various shakes and bars and just concentrate on a healthy diet.
  14. O Perdana from Canada writes: Codex Alimentarius lecture by Ian R. Crane :

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2D4-noTiCg
  15. Ed Long from Canada writes: It has been my understanding that our digestive systems can handle a maximum of 30 grams of protein at one time.

    Protein can be difficult to process and therefore quick absorption proteins, like whey supplements, may be more effective.
  16. Misery No one from Toronto, Canada writes: I remember a story some time back about a boat that capsized off Toronto Island. It took a while for them to be rescued. The thin guy didn't make it the fat one lived. The moral of the story is: We need fat.
  17. va donc chier from Canada writes: gorillas eat plants.
  18. Chris Hooper from Canada writes: ' va donc chier from Canada writes: gorillas eat plants.'

    Are you a gorilla? Last time I checked humans and gorillas differed enough that such a simple omparison, without additional evidence, lacks any legs on which to stand.
  19. CrossFit Guelph from Guelph, Canada writes: Nat Pop. You claim that to get the required calories a serious weight trainer needs protein powder because eating whole foods would cause them to consume too many carbs and fat. This makes no sense. Fat is absolutely necessary for hypertrophy and it is easy to not get carbs ( just don't eat them).
    The rule of thumb for protein consumption when training is 1 gram per pound of Body weight and protein shakes should be consumed 20 min to 45 min post workout.

    L.F - nut ( fat) substitutes can be , avocado and olive oil, both are healthy and calorie dense.
    Fat does not make you fat!
  20. sean paul from Canada writes: if you spend hours working really heavy weights and are serious about being the most beautiful male body, get a trainer. seriously, you'll pickup a lot of very bad advice and information from many who think they know, and the hell of it is, sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong but you don't know. you'll only need a trainer to get you set on diet and form.
    if you're not a gym rat and just like the extra push weight training gives you, just keep the fluids up and have some protein after your workout. my favourite is tinned salmon or sardines. just a sandwich will do.
  21. Ed Long from Canada writes: The advantage of nuts is they represent a nutrition dense snack of protein, fats and carbo plus micro-nutrients.

    If you have an allergy, sunflower and pumpkin seeds do the trick -- raw, unsalted.

    Those poly and monounsaturated fats are very important for rebuilding and energy.

    Many people may have issues with dairy products ... I've switched to goat's milk.

    My classes defined eggs as the perfect protein at approx. 10 grams.

    Red meat, lamb is the best and flank steak is pretty good, is important for heme-iron.

    Nuts, or seeds, berries, eggs, a piece of red meat and veggies and fruits.
  22. CrossFit Guelph from Guelph, Canada writes: Hey Ed, in fact nuts have a minimal protein and carb content and should be considered as a fat source only. Macadamia and Almonds being the best nut bases fat sources.

    ' the protein content of nuts and seeds,grains,and legumes is negligible in terms of both quantity and quality and should not even be considered in the total' Greg Everett Olympic Weightlifting. A complete Guide for Athletes and Coaches

    'mono unsaturated fats fats should make up the bulk of fat intake...nuts seeds, avocado and olive oil' Greg Everett Olympic Weightlifting. A Complete Guide to Athletes and Coaches.
  23. Barclay Logan from Happyville, Hudson's Bay, Canada writes: 'As for the article itself, why only cite one study from Mac? Its not exactly the definitive study. FACT: if you want to gain muscle, you need to eat about 5 times a day. One or two of those meals can be a protein shake. Don't listen to some egghead at a second-rate university. Talk to real athletes and bodybuilders. They stress protein and carbs!' -- so writes someone earlier on ... Rather unhelpful of the author, and the 'egghead' reference speaks volumes. I imagine the university is not, as mentioned, 'second-rate, ' either ... for one thing, this study, though unreplicated (that's how you sell papers -- red wine once a week for eternal life; red wine will kill you tomorrow, red wine will cause unwanted tentacle-growth, etc.), was presumably done with proper scientific design protocols and has numerous citations from previous work in the field, and provides useful information for further study ... 'Mister I-Know-What's-Right-Because-That's-What-I-Think' graces us with an opinion based on anecdotal information, or something he thought of at the McPuke drive-through (sorry, 'thru'). Thanks. Can't trust those 'eggheads,' don't ya know ... As far as protein sources for athletes goes, I found the article interesting. I don't lift weights or do the sports thing, but I get a reasonable amount of exercise at work, and I'm on my bicycle as much as possible, weather permitting. I try to eat a balanced diet, but I don't really pay much attention to whether it's lacking in anything. Don't care for anything that had a face on my plate, so maybe a 'quick fix' of protein's not a bad idea. Hemp and soy protein added to a blenderful of soy and fruit (with flax-derived omegas) have kept me going for quite a while. And what would life be without cashews?
  24. Barclay Logan from Happyville, Hudson's Bay, Canada writes: Eric Helmer from Canada writes: Over the many years of hard lifting and the mountains of protein consumed, I often wondered what if any damage was I doing to my kidneys. I was comfortable knowing my cro-magnon ancestors would sit down to a 10 kilo helping of juicey raw meat without worrying too much about kidney stones. Now I know for sure.



    Not sure what your point is here, Eric ...
  25. Ed Long from Canada writes: CrossFit ... Mr. Everett is training for high level mass and power. 99.99% of the population do not have that regimen nor extreme nutritional requirements.

    I trained people for lean muscle mass and functional applications. Therefore nuts and seeds were a great recovery food, with fluids, until they could get a meal. They are a staple for outdoor endurance like hiking and mountain climbing. The fat is fuel.

    And I always took two proteins to ensure complete spectrum of amino acids.

    Almonds - 23 kernels 1oz/28g - 6g protein, 6g carb, 14g fat (mostly monounsaturated), vitamin E, riboflavin, magnesium, phosphorous, copper, 163 calories.

    Peanut Butter - chunky, no salt, 2tbsp/32g - 8g protein, 7g carb, 16g fat (includes mono.), niacin, magnesium, phosphorous, very low cholesterol, 188 calories.

    Seeds, Sunflower . dried kernels, 100g - 23g protein, 19g carb, 50g fat (includes polyunsaturated) Vitamin E, thiamin, riboflavin, niacin, vitamin B6, folate pantothenic acid, calcium (116mg), iron, magnesium, phosphorous, potassium, zinc, copper, 570 calories.

    Reference: NutritionData.com
  26. Andrew Dice Clay from Canada writes: I was on whey protein shakes and eating eggs on whole wheat every morning.
    I had done it cycles over the last ten years.
    I was wondering why after a few months I would start feeling sick and having terrible stomach prolems.

    I found out after a blood test that I was intolorant to all three..whey, gluten, and eggs.

    I feel great now...bring on the weights
  27. Alfredo Stroessner the III from Canada writes: Just remember this all you guys who want to be big and bulky, keep the regimine going for the rest of your lives. I knew guys who in their early 20's hit the weights hard, did the protein shakes (a couple even went on roids) and got really big within just a couple years or so.

    They then went on with their lives....i.e. marriage, jobs, kids, sports, etc. etc. and eventually found out life got in the way of working out full time. Well, you could probably guess what happened, all that bulk would gradually turn to flab. Now these former muscle head dudes are just plain old fat guys.

    Moral of the story - careful what you wish for.

    Now drop and gimmie 50!!
  28. Ed Long from Canada writes: Andrew ... I made similar discoveries at my ripe old age.

    A doctor put me on an elimination diet and shazzam. He said these 'allergies' can result in metabolic issues and psycho. issues like anxiety or depression.

    Lactose, specifically cow's milk, yoghurt, cottage cheese.

    I grew up in a farm family where we rarely ate 'store bought' products.

    Our food today, especially supplements, are so processed I question whether they are fully metabolized and if the resulting products are all beneficial.
  29. D K from Canada writes: 'L Harder from Canada writes:

    The muscle bound guys should probably get involved in a real sport. '

    ...says the little girly man.
  30. A Deeply concerned and overtaxed citizen from Montreal, Canada writes: lfredo Stroessner the III from Canada writes: Just remember this all you guys who want to be big and bulky, keep the regimine going for the rest of your lives[...] They then went on with their lives...[...]. all that bulk would gradually turn to flab. Now these former muscle head dudes are just plain old fat guys.

    -------------------------------------------

    Muscle does not turn to flab anymore that lead can be turned into to gold. They got flabby because they simply stopped staying in shape for whatever reason.

    Now that that's out of the way. Protein shakes should ONLY be relied upon for your pre and post workouts. Other than that you need to eat well, healthy and about 6 times a day (if your schedule permits) every 3 hours. Stay away from the 'bad' carbs (starches, grains, etc), except for small quantities in the morning and before bed. Stick to eating lean proteins during the day along with the 'good' carbs (veg and/or fruit). Other than that, work hard at the gym, rest hard at home (oh throw in some cardio to trim the fat).
  31. Chevy Luk from Canada writes: http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/pierce34.htm
  32. Liam Bergh from Heard and Mc Donald Islands writes: Alfredo, please show us the metabolic pathway that turns muscle into flab.

  33. L Harder from Canada writes: I have to respond to Mikey and DK. I have been doing physical work all my life and at 45 am a mean 190 pounds with as some have said, muscles on my muscles. This muscle has high power to weight and has aerobic capacity, which means I outwork and outlast most men regardless of age. I take special delight in making young men who should be fitter pay for their lax lifestyle.

    The knuckleheads from my youth are mostly fat. I suspect that is where you too are heading. If you want to get fit come on by and I send you up trees with chainsaws. Then I'll put you in an rowing shell and make you work like you've never worked before. Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger.
  34. L Harder from Canada writes: Furthermore, the weightlifting of knuckleheads serves no useful purpose. You can always tell when someone is an athlete and is well coached compared to someone who is directionless. The athlete is doing sport specific stuff while the meathead spends his time talking with his buddies while occassionaly doing a set. Its not the athletes who are concerned with protein powders, rather the other set who seem to think that it may make up for their lack of activity.
  35. Bob The Builder from Canada writes: L Harder, I don't think you know what you're talking about. For example, elite cross-country skiers who by the way are consistently the fittest people on earth (in terms of VO2 max) incorporate heavy weight lifting into their training regimens (not unlike actual weight lifters). Their weight lifting sessions would consist of compound movements such as bench press, lat pulls, squats at surprisingly heavy weights such that only 4-6 reps can be completed. This is before or after having skied (or sometimes ran) for 3 hours straight.
  36. L Harder from Canada writes: Weights are somewhat controversial in things like X country skiing, swimming, rowing and cycling. Reactionary sports (hockey) spend alot of time on explosiveness, balance, core strength. These workouts have little resemblance to the old gym slogs. There can be success either way. Michael Phelps didn't do any weights on his run to his swimming success. Regardless, the time devoted to weights compared to actually getting out there is highly slanted towards actually swimming, skiing, rowing and cycling.

    I have had two excellent coaches point me in different directions in this regard (I did the weights). Even if weights are done, they are highly specific to the sport and are supplemental with specific goals in mind (core strengthening, muscle imbalance, injury rehab and compensation, specific muscle groups at specific loads and speed).

    At any rate the sport comes first and if the need arises, some weights come later.

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