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A feel-bad victory

Canadian Press

Despite boosting record to 5-0, Ottawa's 4-2 win over Flyers marred by McAmmond concussion ...Read the full article

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  1. k d from Canada writes: I didn't see the game, but I've never liked Downie from his antics in Junior hockey. The guy's a punk. Hope he gets suspended and has his block knocked off when he returns. Hope Dean recovers quickly.
  2. Jim McBob from Canada writes: ok folks ... after Downie's hit I told Jim Junior 2 things
    #1 don't leave your feet when you throw a bodycheck .. it's cheap and most of all ...
    2 when you dish the puck DO NOT look over your shoulder or you will be dead meat.

    What Downie did was dead wrong, but McAmmond was not paying attention.

    And no, this is not the same and Neil's hit on Drury .. Neil did not leave his feet, not was he penalized even after subsequent review by the league. Downie got 5 and a game and it was richly deserved. The real issue here is how he will have to serve his suspension. If he can serve it in the minors its pointless. He should have to be on the roster, which hopefully will have some bearing on whether he makes the team or is ever called up.
  3. Alain LeBlanc from Canada writes: Where does this Downey guy get his attitude? He was a bully to fellow team-mates he decided not to like in junior hockey. A great example of an elite bully. I don't care what his talent level is, these types of behaviours should not be tolerated in what is a high profile professional hockey league watched by people of all ages.
  4. Walt Cummings from Canada writes: Downie is typical of the brain-dead meatheads that somehow find their way into the league. Unfortunately, he's got enough skill to keep him there. Nothing wrong with tough hockey, within the rules. But no need for this kind of stupidity. Guaranteed he doesn't feel he's done anything wrong either.
  5. Craig S from Fredericton, Canada writes: Once a thug, always a thug. He has no business playing hockey
  6. Proud Canadian from Canada, Canada writes: I didnt see the game but Downie is a grad of the Guelph Storm/Peterboro Pete group. A dirty little (b). He will get his number. Someone will get that character. He's another Janseen who plays for New Jersey. Same mould, different name. Both will get payback.
  7. woof woof from Canada writes: Downie has always been a cheap shot artist, remember watching him in the OHL. Its not the team's fault, its him.
    His punishment should be one shift against Ottawa in their next game, thats all it should take.
  8. Andrew Perry from halifax, Canada writes: All the threats by Ottawa and some posters here just set up another Bertuzzi/Moore type situation: Bar the SOB from the NHL for 3 calendar years, that's about what a 20 game suspension would cost him, and suspend the Flygoons coach for ten for even putting this 'fine young man 'out there.
    Philly has never changed: remember , when the Pens drafted Crosby, the Flygoons went out and signed Hacker and three other goons. Some things never change.
  9. Vasili Yeremenko from Canada writes: McAmmond was a student at a school I taught at when he was in Junior. What a class act. I hope he is okay.
  10. g h from Canada writes: If Bob Clarke still carries influence with the final roster selection, then Downie just made the club. And that's no compliment.
  11. Mike Mike from writes: Craig S from Fredericton, Canada writes: Once a thug, always a thug. He has no business playing hockey

    Are you talking about Neil? Anyway... Senators fans are whining about somebody being a dirty player... Sheesh. Downie must have been watching a lot of Sens games and learning from the masters in that area.

    While I agree that hit was illegal and whatever league decides... well... I don't really care. I just hate senators complaining about other teams being dirty. That's just hypocrisy :)
  12. O The Hypocrites Calgary from Canada writes: I missed the check..What is as bad as Neil's vicious hit on Drury last year ???....By the way, it seems I remember we loved Downey last year when he was with Team Canada.....
  13. Bill M from Canada writes: Andrew Perry from halifax, Canada writes: All the threats by Ottawa and some posters here just set up another Bertuzzi/Moore type situation: Bar the SOB from the NHL for 3 calendar years, that's about what a 20 game suspension would cost him, and suspend the Flygoons coach for ten for even putting this 'fine young man 'out there.

    Based on last years playoffs, my guess is he gets 1 game. That's all Pronger got for his head hunting, and it was his seventh offence. For whatever reason, the NHL feels it's okay to try to decapitate someone on the ice, but a minor fender bender while drinking on personal time is worth a minimum 15 games. Something's wrong with this picture. And no. I'm not a Sens fan, nor a Leaf fan.
  14. jim B from Ottawa, Canada writes: If someone else compares the hit to what Neil did to Drury they need their head examined. Neil hit Drury in open ice and cleanly thus the non penalty and no suspension . Downie will be suspended and was tossed from the game. TWO DIFFERENT HITS...one legal... one illegal!

    C'mon...it is one thing to have good natured ribbing between rival fans but please do not try and make light of a very bad injury.

    I know that there are a lot of Sens haters since Ottawa became Canada's only really good shot at anything..but please..your team may not be good... but just because the Sens are a talented team that beats yours.. doesn't mean you should make light of what happened last night.

    Dean may never play again. Downie will play again.
  15. f c from Canada writes: Although I didn't see the game, it sounds like he made an illegal check. Not that I would ever defend this crap, but, what is funny though is that a genuine goon like McGratton states that we don't need things like this happening in the league....

    Hello pot, this is the kettle....you're black. Get over it McGratton, you have taken more than your fair shair of cheapies and injured players. Now you are threatening him yourself......don't be a hypocrite.
  16. jim B from Ottawa, Canada writes: Confused here..help me...was McGratten ever suspended for an illegal check??....NO

    What he was talking about was ending a guys career..McGratten fights with willing participants..not even the same thing...why are there non hockey fans taking about this... if you were a fan of the game you wouldn't mention McGratten in this.

    Downie was trying to knock a guy out illegally...period.

    Sens are always going to have a lot of jealous rival fans...just because your team would get smoked by the Sens doesn't mean you should make light of this.
  17. Midtown Bob from Toronto, Canada writes: The good old hockey game, la la la la laaaaaaaa
    To Brian McGrattan: ever hear of Todd Bertuzzi?
    I saw the hit and it was no more vicious than anything you see on a Sunday afternoon in the NFL.
  18. d a from United Kingdom writes: Midtown Bod .. I'd prefer to hit and fall on grass than ice ... everytime I've been checked and dropped to the ice, it was the impact on the ice that hurt more than the body-to-body contact. Not to mention the fact that collisions on ice are at higher speeds than in NFL ... higher speeds means higher impact force means ouch.
  19. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Midtown Bob- you mean no more vicious than you'd see Darcy Cocktucker or Tie Domi lay right?
  20. Jay D from Ottawa, Canada writes: I saw this hit and I have two comments. One, Downie should have let up and the hit was late. There is no question in my mind that it was a cheap shot. Two, McAmmond wasn't admiring his pass so much as following the play. As he circled the net he dumped the puck back out front behind him. It was natural for him to come around the other side of the net and look to see if there was a return pass. Downie had him lined up from as far out as the top of the face-off circle. It was way worse than an NFL hit. The impact force was massive because Downie had a head of steam, which caused McAmmond to bounce off the end boards (about 3 feet away) and then hit the ice. Downie should get 15 games for this, but given he'll probably end up back in the AHL it will not mean much.
  21. Ben H from Canada writes: Speaking as a Leaf fan who has nothing but contempt for the Sens, that was a dirty, dirty hit.

    Now McGratton just needs to learn to keep his pie-hole shut. Have some class you Neanderthal.
  22. Peter Roberts from Canada writes: Make an example of Steve Downie for his hit on Dean McAmmond. Downie left his feet, went for a head shot, was retaliating for a hit he had received earlier in his shift and is an individual who seems to re-offend. The penalty for him should be a 30 game suspension from the NHL (and its affiliates). Also a new suspension system should be implemented into the NHL for individuals who like to purposely injure their fellow players. First offence is an X game suspension. Second offence is X 20-40 game suspension plus a HEFTY fine (I am sure steve downie does not have a big contract so fine him most of his contract and then maybe he will think) If someone gets to this point then they are too stupid to understand punishments and should be banned from the NHL. I have a feeling Downie may fall into this category so lets call the new suspension system the Downie System.
  23. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Hey Pete I like your suggestion. How did Downie ever make it to the NHL? Oh wait- Bob Clarke.

    This has to be the craziest pre-season ever with this incident and the Chris Simon thing. Chuck Wang shaking his players hands after that game is disgusting.
  24. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: A few things:

    1) The hit is not the same as Neil's hit on Drury. Downie left his feet after being hit by Schubert and was looking for revenge. Downie has a mean streak to him and in response to an earlier poster, I for one was not a fan of Downie's during the juniors. After his antics throughout junior hockey, I don't think he deserved a spot on that team. Sure, he has talent, but a terrible attititude as well.

    2) Sadly, this could have helped him win a roster spot. Philly's style of play is well known, I wouldn't be surprised to see him suit up this year.

    3) Whoever is attacking McGratton for dirty hits probably does not watch very much hockey at all, but rather, hates the voilence in the game and sees hitting and fighting as two in the same. The only real damage McGratton does is when he is fighting with another consenting player. There is a BIG difference between fighting and laying dirty hits.

    4) McAmmond's career could be in question here. Mindless rants about the Sens at this point is just classless. Save it for another time.
  25. Bubbles McBubbles from Trawna, Canada writes: I'll lose my Don Cherry fan club membership, but isn't it time we eliminated contact altogether? The women's game has none of it and yet it's still enjoyable to watch. (blasphemy, I know) 'It's part of the game!' comes the gutteral chorus of neandrathals with Leaf's Nation license plates.

    And as for the following statement:

    'He'll get what's coming to him next time we play him, that's for sure.'

    If no one is going to phone the police on this guy then I will.
  26. Arron D from Stan's Home, Canada writes: Bubbles, you can 'get yours' entirely legally in the NHL. that was why God created the corners. McGrattan will neither need to ; charge Duncie from the blue line to feed him some payback, nor need to leave the ice to connect. Clean hitting can be good and hard, and the of course, falling on his, 'finishing his check' with an elbow, or something wouldn't hardly be noticed by anyone who wasn't in the know.
    Duncie isn't man enough to go hunting McGrattan, he'd prefer to chase people with their heads and/ or backs to him.
    Bubbles, as was said above, McGrattan only plays with his own playmates, you'd never see him line up Crosby or the best leafs player ( the waterbottle boy). He would go for Gill, or Tuckit, or Mc$abe, the 'real ' hitters in toronto.
    So I don't feel that anything McGrattan said would be any worse than I would have said if I had been there, or really anyone from these forums would have said.
    I still say go light on Duncie, his NHL day is over. Hammer the Flyer's organization. If you want change, make it a money sea change and watch the good work spread.
  27. R K from Canada writes: McAmmond would get knocked out if you sneezed on him...We saw that in the finals...perhaps he should hang them up before it's too late.
    As far as Downie goes, his hit was dirty but if he had hit any other player, they would have likely got up and carried on. He deserves a suspension but let's hope the league doesn't over react because he happenned to hit someone who had a 'soft mellon' to begin with.
  28. R A from Canada writes: Thats right Bubbles, Arron is right. McGratton, who is 6'4' and 231 pounds would have no problem going after a guy like Tucker who is 5'10' and 178 pounds...he is a straight shooting man's man alright.

    And also, Ottawa has no goons - Neil and McGratton are just a little misunderstood...you know, as they smash opposing players from behind into the boards. Hell, even their team captain gets a bad rap for being a dirty player...funny how that is?!?
  29. Bubbles McBubbles from Trawna, Canada writes: Arron D from Stan's Home, Canada writes: 'Bubbles, you can 'get yours' entirely legally in the NHL. that was why God created the corners.'

    Arron I appreciate your point. But what is entirely legal in the NHL is not legal under the criminal code. That seems to disappear the moment anyone laces on skates. What would satisfying retribution be for the Sens player who issued that threat? A clean hit in the corner? I don't think so.

    Your other point about fining the organization is well taken because all they understand is the bottom line. Listen, I've hollered for blood before - Clarke's cheap hit on the Russian comes to mind. And being from Trawna, I love to hate the Sens. But I'm getting sick of seeing good players getting knocked out of the season by cheap thugs. It drags the game down. As for goons sticking to fighting goons, Gretz might disagree with you there. If McSorley hadn't been there to watch his back then the Great One's career might not have been that great.
  30. uncle rukus from Mississauga, Canada writes: Coming from the perspective of a Sabre fan is nice to see all these Ottawa fans justifiying the Drury hit as clean and this hit as dirty. We can argue to the cows come home but the common dominator is the lack of respect in the game of hockey. Downie and Neil had the same intent folks and that was to hurt if not put someone out of commission. Left his feet or not leaving your feet is not the point Neil saw Drury was in a helpless poistion and took his shoulder aimed it at his head and blindsided him...Downie also saw McAmmond in a helpless position and got his revenge with a severe headshot. The funny thing is if Downie gets a big suspension watch the player's union jump up and scream but the same union cares less about the guy who has suffered two concussions in 3 months and will not lobby for him. And you wonder why hockey registration is not as high as it use too.
  31. Cassandra from Ottawa from Canada writes: Eveyone at the game, and that includes Bob Mckenzie of TSN, knew that
    Downie charged at McAmmond with an intent to injure.
  32. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: RA is obviously a Leaf fan so is writing from the mental ward- give him a break.

    He wants Downie on his team- Tucker junior.
  33. Another Pundit from Canada writes: I seem to remember that when Kaberle fell victim to a cheap shot, 99 per-cent of Sens fans put the usual dribble aside and said it was a clear cheap shot that the NHL has to take action against.

    Some Leaf fans want Downie to get a suspension, but most just want to use this incident and blantent cheap shot to take cheap shots at the Sens.

    How can so many of you continue to be utterly classless? It was a dangerous, cheap hit. If someone did this to say, Steen, would you Leaf fans be laughing about it and saying your team deserved it? Don't remember any of you thinking that about Kaberle...

    Hopefully McAmmond will be able to make a (quick) recovery.
  34. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: R K, what a foolish post. Have you seen the hit? To say that 'if he had hit any other player, they would have likely got up and carried on.', is just ridiculous. That was a brutal hit that would have taken the vast majority of players out.
  35. George Hall from Canada writes: The NHL is a two bit mickey mouse league...if fans actually appreciated the game they would lessen the goonery
  36. R A from Canada writes: Gidiot, I never said I wanted Downie on my team - for the record, I think he shouldnt be allowed to play if he goes head hunting like that.

    And also, McAmmond is a good player and doesnt deserve to lose his livelyhood by a guy like that - I hope he recovers soon.
  37. R A from Canada writes: Another Pundit. I agree with what you are saying and I believe that 99% or Leafs fans dont want to see anybody get hurt with a cheap shot like that. Just because someone posts drivel on here don't automatically assume that they are a Leafs fan or that they speak for most Leafs fans.

    We might not like Ottawa but thats just a rivaly - we dont want to see anybody hurt like that.
  38. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: R A, you know that the size isn't really the determinant for a guy like Tucker dropping the gloves, it is the willingness of the player. He is smaller than most fighters in the NHL, but he still drops the gloves. And a lot of the time, he picks the fight.

    As an example, see this clip of him picking a fight with Mike Fisher.....and losing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1fvGjurF6s

    The fact that Tucker is smaller, yet tends to pick fights, is irrelevant.
  39. John Stanton from Canada writes: Looks like McAmmond wont be playing much longer with a weak noggin. As always, the same boring stories are playing out, Leafs suck and Ottawa cant take the physical play. At least there is Anaheim to watch!
  40. Marcel Coulombe from quebec, Canada writes: un coup vicieux de la part d/un idiot.
  41. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: I'm sorry to see Downie do this, and hope McAmmond is able to play again soon.

    This hit is in spirit the same as the Neil/Drury incident. Here Downie wanted to make a name for himself on the big club and went too far - I wouldn't be too harsh on him, the game moves at such a fast pace the total amount of premeditation is probably a second or two at most. He made a split decision to hit someone in the head, just like Neil did.

    If you're going to crucify Downie, put him in the same boat as Neil.
  42. greg panke from orangeville, Canada writes: Goon hockey in the NHL is alive and well. The Pens had a guy last year, his name I can't recall, who loved to do something similar, the Ducks have their goons and now the Flyers have at least one. Many teams are picking them up because the league has never demonstrated any consistently strong actions against that style of play.

    I stopped watching hockey many years ago, in the Broadstreet Bully days, and started watching again half a dozen or so years ago when teams like the Sens were showing real hockey skill. If the league is going to drift back towards mayhem as a method to win, then I will won't bother watching, and I hope most others will do the same.
  43. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Dumb Sucker- Downie didn't make a 'split second' decision like Neil. He had McAmmond lined up from the top of the faceoff circle the moment he saw him skate behind the net. Schubert had just laid him out and he was obviously looking for someone to nail in retaliation.

    RA you're backtracking on your comments pretty quick- nice to see you recognize the fact that you're a boob.
  44. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: Gideon Goldshlager - So would you classify the Neil/Drury incident as clean with no intent to injure?
  45. R A from Canada writes: Gidiot...how am I backtracking?!?
  46. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: Thumb Sucker, I have to disagree. Anyone watching the game would have noticed that, after being hit (cleanly) by Schubert, Downie wanted revenge. It was not a split second reaction, it was premeditated, and you could see in the way Downie was skating leading up to the hit that he had full intention of taking out McAmmond. Add that to Downie's record of being especially mean and dirty, I think it's hard to make a case that it was just a spur of the moment hit.
  47. Liz Jackson from Renfrew, Canada writes: That's the sort of dirt that keeps many from watching the game.

    It's time they start recruiting for brains instead of big palookas.
    We need more Gretzy type players and less goons.
  48. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: RA- sorry I got you confused with RK. RK is the bonehead Leaf fan I was referring to.

    C*ck Sucker- I wouldn't put the Neil hit in the same category. Like you said- split second decision. Can you really form an 'intent' in a split second? It was a reaction. Maybe not the right one, but a reaction. Downie clearly had intent.
  49. jim B from Ottawa, Canada writes: John Stanton and Thumbsucker....Neil never got a penalty because it was legal.

    If you think it was a case of weak noggins...please ask any Anaheim player to present himself on the ice and look to his left...I will skate full out and catch him in the head with my shoulder pad...see how 'tough' he is.

    you are an idiot.
  50. R A from Canada writes: Hopy crap, a sorry out of Gidiot - Im gonna mark this day in my calendar bud.
  51. Moose Lion from Canada writes: Downie is an embarrasment to Canadian hockey. I saw him play at the World Juniors last year and he does nothing but whine and bi%ch all game long. Would love to see someone lay a beating on him.
  52. K N from Canada writes: Downie was the same guy who knocked out the teeth of one of his teamates in Junior for refusing to accept a cruel hazing ritual. I would penalize Downie by banning him from playing any level of hockey at least until Dean McCammond is back and playing again in the NHL. If McCammond never plays in NHL again, then it is 'sayanora' for Downie -- he can always get a job as a bouncer (or play Todd Bertuzzi in a made-for TV movie about how Steve Moore's career was ended.) I have hated the Flyers since the 70s for their dirty play -- and just when you think the Flygoons may be chanhinh now that Bobby Clarke has finally gone, a goon like Downie comes along.
  53. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: jim B from Ottawa, Canada writes: John Stanton and Thumbsucker....Neil never got a penalty because it was legal.

    I never said it was illegal, but it was dirty in the sense that he was trying to gain an advantage for his team by hurting a player on the other team, just as Downie was trying to gain an advantage for himself by looking like a tough guy. Neil is a dirty player who takes lots of cheap-shots, I've watched enough Sens games to know that.

    Gideon Goldshlager - John Bucigross writes for ESPN and he wrote an article about that hit breaking down the timing of it and such, after reading that I concluded that Neil had enough time to change his body position to not hit Drury's shoulder but his head - Legal and dirty.

    If a hit like that (on Drury) is legal it does not come as a suprise that young players would throw a hit like Downie did last night. Some players (Neil, Marchment, Kasperitis, Domi, Bertuzzi and now Downie) try to injure other players, don't get so upset just because it happens to a player on your favorite team.
  54. Mike Mike from writes: Did anybody else notice how ALL hits by sens are legal and how ALL hits that knock senators on their behinds are illegal and require the most severe punishment? Anybody?
  55. Dman West Coast from Canada writes: Downie is a young player trying to make an NHL team.
    What concerned me about the hit more than anything was the fact that he bulleted straight down the ice at top speed to get him. Not a thought of playing the puck.

    Mcammond, after a few head injuries should get it by now that he needs to keep his head up.
    What about his teammates giving him a warning the guy was coming?

    That said, it was a hit that should not have been made period!

    If Clarke, who still runs that team had any class, he'd send Downie to the minors where he'll end up anyway this season, and the controversy will have a chance to die down.
  56. Patrick Smith from Markham, Canada writes: Isn't it about time the NHL just say 'no more hits to the head, no more leaving your feet'- period, end of story? Neil's hit on Drury...questionable, but not dirty (and I'm a card-carrying member of Leafs Nation). At first glance it looked bad, but realise that Neil didn't leave his feet, and Drury had his head down (which you're taught never to do)- Neil caught him from the side (at first I thought he got him from behind). Then there's Downie; leaving his feet and going for the head. Two big no-no's. I'm not suggesting the NHL morph into ringette, but they can eliminate shots to the head and keep the physical side of the game.

    In rugby a hit like that would merit a six-week ban for a first-time offender- roughly 25-30% of their season.
  57. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: Mike Mike, try making some sense. That hit was illegal, and you ought to know it. And yes, it does deserve punishment.

    You really have quitethe hard on for the Sens (or just Ottawa in general?), don't you...
  58. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Dumb *ucker- conclude what you want but Neil's hit was clean and the NHL agreed. It was a shoulder, not an elbow, and he didn't leave his feet. The two aren't even comparable.

    Neil's not a dirty player- not even close. When has he ever been suspended? Downie hasn't even played a regular season game yet and he's already gone.

    Your comparison is laughable.
  59. Proud Canadian from Canada, Canada writes: People, the guys playing in the NHL are there to make a living and provide entertainment to all of us. Same as the guy in the factory or in the stores. There to make a living. Now you got 2 big time idiots in the NHL, Cam Jansenn in New Jersey and Steve Downie in Philly. Big time idiots. Saw them in the OHL, mark my word, cement heads. If these 2 guys are trying to take the living from anyone else, its time to get rid of these out of hockey. No guff. Out they go. Grandfather it, make them the 1st 2 of many. No need for these guys in hockey, if they cant be goalies, defencemen or forwards, out they go. No cement heads, no people who only out there to mame others. Thats what has to be done. do they have the guts to do it? No.
  60. Jim McBob from Canada writes: Neil's hit on Drury was legal. Downie's was not, by a mile. Therefore there is a difference and Neil and Downie should not be painted with the same brush.

    However, the NHL and NHLPA need to do a better job of protecting players. I like Chris Neil but if the league makes the sort of hit that Neil made on Drury illegal that would be fine with me. I'm sure Neil can adjust. I doubt Downie ever will.

    I bumped into Dean and his son on Monday night (he was not in the lineup vs the Leafs). He's a regular guy. It's ironic that 24 hours later, in a preseason game no less, his career may have ended. It's all the more concerning, as my son plays a similar style of game (i.e. big speed) and I worry that he will get his melon knocked off my some jerk.

    The name calling of Sens haters would be mildly (but not very) funny if it not for the fact that a human being and father of 3 little kids got smoked last night. It's actually quite pathetic.
  61. Paul Hume from Canada writes: Mike Mike from writes: Did anybody else notice how ALL hits by sens are legal and how ALL hits that knock senators on their behinds are illegal and require the most severe punishment? Anybody?

    Pretty bitter fella aren't ya?

    No, no, and no. Try reading a bit fella, I'm not a big fan of anyone making an illegal hit or intentionally trying to end another players career.

    I hope that Dean is ok and gets to play this year.
  62. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: GG-

    'Chris Neil's hit on Andy McDonald was reprehensible,' Burke said. 'You guys go back and break down the tape. He took six strides in from the blue line; he's going full speed, full extension, elbow right to the head. Our player skates away, [Neil] gets a free pass. Their player gets hurt, Chris Pronger gets a game.

    'The most dangerous play in the game last night was not Chris Pronger's hit on Dean McAmmond. It was Neil's hit on Andy McDonald. That's the troubling part for us,' Burke said.

    Neil is dirty, always has been, always will be.

    If you need video evidence of what a dirty player he is

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UDiUzP5pvU

    Hey Jim McBob, Andy Mcdonald has a family too, so does Chris Drury.
  63. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: Take a look at that video and tell me it wasn't a dirty play, you can't.

    I don't like Chris Neil because he is a dangerous, dirty player that brings down the quality and the integrety of the NHL.

    Seems you GG, only defend him because he is on the Sens, if he was a Leaf you would be the first one to call to hang him.

    Hypocrite.
  64. Paul Hume from Canada writes: Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: I don't like Chris Neil because he is a dangerous, dirty player that brings down the quality and the integrety of the NHL.

    Funny, I felt the same way about Tucker and Domi.

    These arguements are pointless, you say this I say that. All of our goons are not saints by any stretch of the imagination. Whether it is Neil on my SENS or Downie playing my team. I really don't see the point in arguing which goon is dirtier like it's some sort of contest. Bottom line is that someone was intentionally hurt, and what is the league going to do about it?
  65. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Dirty? NHL didn't think so chum...p.

    Notice MacDonald turning & ducking at the last millisecond? If he didnt do that Neil doesn't hit his head.

    Also notice how MacDonald gets up and skates away?

    Also notice none of the other Duckies challenging Neil? If it was so dirty how come?

    Every time you post something you tell the world how stupid you are.
  66. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: Paul Hume - the league should change the rules so goons won't have a place in the game.
    Not sure how to go about this, but I think completely eliminating headshots would be a good start, and longer suspensions for those that break the rules.

    'Funny, I felt the same way about Tucker and Domi.'

    Why is that funny? I feel that way too. Anyone who actually likes Domi is not a hockey fan, they are a Leafs fan.
  67. Paul Hume from Canada writes: Not funny hawhaw mind you.

    I'm in agreement with you regarding any rule changes regarding headshots/cheapshots, regardless of who does the hitting.
  68. Slander Us from Toronto, Canada writes: I love the fact that Mike Mike and Thumb Sucker continually go on about the Neil hit, conveniently omitting the FACT that the NHL took a look at both the Drury hit and the MacDonald hit and ruled them both clean. Obviously you guys know the game and rules better than the NHL head offices, Colin Campbell and the like. Either that, or as many posters have stated, you just hate Ottawa so much that you'll take any excuse to bash them and ignore logic and fact. My guess is that it's the latter. Get over Neil's hits - Burke was blowing smoke trying to get the attention off Pronger's second cheap shot of the p/o last year, and Drury has since admitted that while he didn't like the Neil hit, he's accepted that it's legal until they change the rules. Hate the Sens all you want, but the bottom line is that Downie lined McAmmond up from centre ice and had no intention of playing the puck. He was nailed by 2 clean hits and retaliated by acting in an indefensible manner (well, indefensible except to Sens haters). Downie will be suspended, and I guess you can just continue blathering on about Neil and ignoring the ruling's of the NHL on his hit and all of Neil's hits.
  69. Slander Us from Toronto, Canada writes: BTW - I am in agreement with anyone that says head shots of any kind should be outlawed by the league. I personally didn't like Neil's hit on Drury, or Colby Armstrong's hits on Koivu and Eaves - but iunfortunately the NHL rules them legal. To me, all head shots should be illegal, and then there would be no need to debate how legal Neil'd hit, or Downie's hits were. They should have rules that make ALL of these hits against the rules.
  70. Mike Mike from writes: Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: Mike Mike, try making some sense. That hit was illegal, and you ought to know it. And yes, it does deserve punishment.

    You really have quitethe hard on for the Sens (or just Ottawa in general?), don't you...

    I wouldn't call it a hard on... more like a soft spot :)

    And I did not say the hit was legal, so before you bash me read careful what I said. What I said is that sens whining about that hit is hypocritical as they themselves dished out a fair share of dirty illegal hits. Get it now? Does this make more sense to you or should I type slo-o-o-w-e-r?
  71. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: So we're in agreement that rules should change, and Gideon should change too. Physically through a sex change operation that is, into the woman that begs to get out of his poorly endowed semi-man body.

    Gillian Goldschlager has a nice ring to it.
  72. Donny Lalouche from Canada writes: Steve Moore left his feet when he hit Naslund a few years ago. Naslund was concussed. The league did nothing and we all know how that ended.

    I expect that the NHL will attempt to make some sort of 'statement' to a player - Downie - who like Moore, shouldn't even be in the league to begin with.

    There's head shot in every game. Too bad the NHL only believes in addressing the ones that cause public outrage.

    Typically gutless NHL officiating and 'after the fact' discipline from NHL HQ.

    We've been here before.
  73. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: C*ock Sucker- great comback.

    Nice to see at least that you've given up your argument. You were the last person on here to figure out you're wrong.

    Mike Mike- you're a dumb dumb. Yeah type slower- maybe you'll make more sense. When have any Sens players been suspended for 'illegal or dirty' hits.
  74. Slander Us from Toronto, Canada writes: Guys - give us a break on calling the Sens whiners for complaining about this. Darcy Tucker went on-and-on about the Jansenn hit last year, yet many will point to numerous indiscretions by both him and the Leafs. All teams are guilty of crossing the lines sometimes, and all teams are guilty of whining too much about it. That's sports - you stick up for your team mates no matter what. So to call the Sens whiners is ridiculous - every team has whiners and every team has had some incident in the past 5 years that was dirty. You whining about people whining is just laughable.
  75. Thumb Sucker from Canada writes: Gillian, yes, you sure did win this argument with nothing but perfect logical retorts.

    'Also notice none of the other Duckies challenging Neil? If it was so dirty how come?'

    Flawless.

    'Neil's not a dirty player- not even close. When has he ever been suspended?'

    Backed that up perfectly.

    'RA is obviously a Leaf fan so is writing from the mental ward- give him a break.'

    Impeccable.

    In your own words Gill, you are a 'looser'.
  76. Jasper the Black Lab from Vancouver, Canada writes: With his ability to jump like that at high speed, and with some major psychological counselling, Downie might have a future in figure skating. Goodness knows he is just about finished in pro hockey.
  77. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Dumb *ucker you're incredulous. Answer those questions if you want to defend your argument. I asked them- how can I retort my own questions? You obviously have no response. The hits are not comparable. Your silence admits that. 'Nuff said.

    Don't know what my comment about RA has to do with it- that was about 100 posts ago.

    Pretty sure I've never misspelled 'loser'. I use it enough on here addressing Leaf fans so I should know how to spell it.

    Never mind- back to reading your picture books.
  78. Jim McBob from Canada writes: Thumbsucker. Nice job quoting Brian Burke. He's the guy who defended Todd Bertuzzi after he almost killed Steve Moore. Verrrry objective.
  79. j.r ewing from vancouver, Canada writes: Neil hit Andy Macdonald in the playoffs, left his feet and elbowed him in the head. Luckily Andy got up and was o.k. Sometimes guys get hurt sometimes they don't. I think Mcgratts said it best when he said he'll get whats coming to him. The payback for Downie line is gettting long.
  80. j.r ewing from vancouver, Canada writes: Gideon the reason nobody attacked Neil after was because they were busy trying to win the stanley cup. Notice how Macdonald scored two goals to finish of the Sens that game. Petty pay back or take the cup. tough one.
  81. Mike Mike from writes: Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Mike Mike- you're a dumb dumb. Yeah type slower- maybe you'll make more sense. When have any Sens players been suspended for 'illegal or dirty' hits.

    Aah... sens fans' class shines through and through... Name calling, hurling insults... lovely. Keep it up, keep it up. I have no problem with that.
  82. Lord Stanley from Canada writes: Mike Mike - While I agree that name calling is childish at best, I noticed you didn't answer Gideon's question ... Are you still researching your answer?
  83. JIm Smith from writes: 'Neil's hit on Drury was legal. Downie's was not, by a mile. Therefore there is a difference and Neil and Downie should not be painted with the same brush.'

    By saying that you expose your bias and the rest of your argument becomes garbage. The hits were very similar in nature.

    This is not beer league hockey, this is the NHL. This is a league for the best of the best where admiring your pass is meet with a thunderous body check not not a kiss on the cheek.

    Everyone against 'hits to the head' always qualifies their statement by. 'Yes his head was down and yes he wasn't paying attention to the play, but he shouldn't have been hit.' I guess to some of you hockey shouldn't be a contact sport.

    THIS IS THE NHL, not ballet, or womens hockey, or minor hockey. I have a simple solution to hits to the head. Keep your head up. I have yet to see a player who had his head up get hit in the head, but I have seen a lot of people who are admiring their pass get leveled. Strange coincidence.
  84. Ryan M from Ottawa, Canada writes: Mike Mike, my apologies, you did in fact agree that the hit was illegal.
  85. Mark M from Toronto, Canada writes: This is the NHL's oportunity to set the tone for how they treat head shots this year. I say throw the book at this kid and suspend him from NHL and minor league games for 3 months.

    A tough stance by the league will also lessen the chance of pre-meditated retribution. A long suspension might be for the kids own safety as well.

    What a moron.
  86. Another Pundit from Canada writes: Downie's hit was similar to Jensen's (in blatently going outside what is legal to try and hurt someone)

    Neil's hit was similar to Armstrong's (in keeping the hits legal under the current rules)

    Try and keep your comparisons honest. And to the people saying Sens fans are only crying because they want a double standard, you have to remember that when Armstrong took out Eaves Sens fans were first to say the hit was legal.

    Downie made a huge mistake. He hasn't even played an NHL game yet. If the league doesn't take serious action it will make the NHL look even more of a joke.
  87. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Jim Smith- no bias at all. Not similar. Neil didn't leave his feet, nor did he take an 18 ft run at the other guy.

    Mike- you're obviously a Leaf drone. What would you know about class?
    You didn't answer the question either.
  88. Scot Loucks from Pickering, Canada writes: A week to go before the season actually starts..... and the trash talk just keeps on coming... wow.

    Dirty illegal hit by Downie. Hope they throw the book at him.
  89. Mike Mike from writes: Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Jim Smith- no bias at all. Not similar. Neil didn't leave his feet, nor did he take an 18 ft run at the other guy.

    Mike- you're obviously a Leaf drone. What would you know about class?
    You didn't answer the question either.

    The question about when was the last time Sens player got suspended? Ok. How about pimp daddy Emery whacking Lapierre across the face with his stick last season? Or was that perfectly legal too? He got 3 games I believe. And to me this was far more vicious than Downie's hit (ILLEGAL, see, read again... i-l-l-e-g-a-l... I am typing very slowly now so that you can understand)
    And for about 1000th time I am not a leafs fan. You will be surprised but if you followed any fan forum 'discussions' last spring, there aren't many teams in the NHL whose fans don't despise Senators.
  90. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Mike Mike (Dumb Dumb) - you're right about Emery. The question tho was when was any Sens player suspended for an illegal or dirty hit? All the Sens bashers here are saying Neil, McGrattan, Alfie etc. are dirty- guess the NHL doesn't think so.

    The majority of fans (outside the GTA that is) were behind the Sens if I remember correctly last year. Just like Edmonton the year before that, Calgary the year before that. In Toronto the offseason's so long they forget what hockey is by the time the next season rolls around. If you have some bitter little hate on for the Sens that's your own issue. I'm sitting here smiling smugly in your direction.
  91. Proud Canadian from Canada, Canada writes: Mike Mike, time u kept the threads for Calgary viewers. Makes absolutely no sense to anyone East of Medicine Hat of what you say. Ur so obsessed with the Sens (hatred) that you have a hard time seeing the forrest for the trees. Hope you have a good season. Now get into the bubblies or the whacko, do yourself a favour.
  92. Donny Lalouche from Vancouver, Canada writes: No one really cares about Downie. We all wish we had a guy like him on our favorite team. The Senators have 2 - McGrattan and Neil.

    McAmmond got caught with his head down admiring a pass. Same as Kaberle last year.

    Everyone who says that Downie should get more of a suspension than Pronger got for his hit last year is a hypocrite or a Sens fan. Or both.

    Let's just move on from this irrelevant argument.
  93. Montgomery C. Burns from Springfield, Canada writes: Whether or not Downie meant to hurt McAmmond or not is irrelevant; he left his feet before he hit him which should result in a suspension. For those of you who have not seen the video check this one out and watch carefully at the 6 second and 11 second marks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=322zqTkL0-c
  94. Gideon Goldshlager from Canada writes: Tell me Mike Mike Dumb Dumb- were there any suspensions? Thought not.

    Nobody cares what you think loser- back to obsessing about the Sens. I guess that's what happens when you're the best team in the league.

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